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That Real Estate Tech Guy

That Real Estate Tech Guy

By: Jordan Samuel Fleming
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Welcome to the only weekly podcast dedicated to the Real Estate Investing Tech Stack, hosted by Jordan Samuel Fleming. Jordan has been heavily involved in building technology tools for Real Estate Investors for over a decade, and is the Co-Founder and CEO of smrtPhone, and all-in-one cloud phone system and power dialer. If you're serious about scaling up your Real Estate Investing business then this weekly podcast is for you! You'll learn from the best as each week Jordan speaks with individual investors who have leveraged technology to scale their businesses, as well as technology companies who build the tools you use on a daily basis. That Real Estate Tech Guy brings together expert insights, advice and the latest technology tips for any investor looking to build their Real Estate Investing business.

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Episodes
  • The Boring Real Estate Strategy That Quietly Builds Wealth ft. Brian Waters

    The Boring Real Estate Strategy That Quietly Builds Wealth ft. Brian Waters
    Jun 18 2026

    This week I'm joined by Brian Waters, a Los Angeles fire captain, certified flight instructor, and founder of the Rental Property Playbook who teaches hardworking W-2 earners how to build single family rental portfolios out of state. Brian lives in California but invests across Alabama, Georgia, Michigan, and Tennessee, all without quitting the job he genuinely loves.

    We get into why he chose the most boring, tried and true strategy in real estate, how a property management team means he's never fixed a toilet in his life, and why keeping your W-2 is the smartest risk mitigation move you can make. If you're a first responder, a pilot, or any busy professional who wants passive income without blowing up your career, this conversation is for you.


    Episode Timeline & Highlights

    [3:09] – Brian introduces himself, an LA fire captain and founder of the Rental Property Playbook teaching W-2 earners to buy out of state

    [3:50] – From a teenage pilot's license to a medevac career in Hawaii to a 2008 airline layoff that pushed him into firefighting

    [6:30] – How cockpit habits like checklists, SOPs, and crew resource management became his real estate operating system

    [7:01] – Why first responders make some of his most successful real estate students

    [8:47] – Real estate as additive, not an escape from a career you actually love

    [11:23] – The real reason to keep your W-2: lending leverage and protection from a single roof leak or foundation problem

    [14:30] – The overtime trap that wrecks firefighter families and the lifestyle Brian built instead

    [15:48] – How teaching buddies for free turned into a paid coaching community after a nudge from his wife

    [17:13] – Why he picked the most boring, tried and true play over wholesaling, land, or syndications

    [18:27] – The mentor advice that changed everything: get hyper specific at one thing and never change it

    [20:23] – Tenants and toilets solved with out of state investing and a solid property management team

    [23:31] – The four pillars of real estate returns and why Brian feels like he's always winning

    [26:25] – The BRRRR method and how he buys four properties at a time using private and hard money

    [33:05] – Why he caps his community at under 150 people and still answers his own DMs

    [36:56] – How to find Brian and join the free Rental Property Playbook community


    5 Key Takeaways

    1. Keep The Job You Love — Real estate doesn't have to be an exit. Brian added single family rentals as a second income stream while staying a fire captain, which gives him lending leverage and a financial safety net.
    2. Get Hyper Specific At One Thing — A mentor told him to master one strategy and never change it. He chose three bed, two bath single family homes because they're the most rented, sold, and refinanced asset in the country.
    3. Out Of State Removes The Temptation — Investing far from home forces him to lean on systems and a property management team instead of driving over to fix a toilet himself. He's never done drywall in his life.
    4. Budget For When, Not If — Stuff breaks in every asset class. He underwrites every deal with money set aside for vacancies and maintenance, so a surprise repair never turns into a crisis.
    5. Small Community, Real Access — Brian caps his program under 150 people so students get his actual cell number and direct coaching, the opposite of being a dot on page 100 of a Zoom call.


    Links & Resources

    • Brian Waters / The Rental Property Playbook (Code 3 Invest) — https://code3invest.com/ (his actual coaching + community hub; "Rental Property Playbook" is his podcast/brand, but code3invest.com is where people sign up and reach him)
      Brian Waters on Instagram — https://www.instagram.com/mr.brian.waters/ \
      SmrtPhone — https://www.smrtphone.io/
      That Real Estate Tech Guy — https://thatrealestatetechguy.com/

    If you've ever assumed out of state rentals are too risky or that you'd have to quit your job to build real wealth, Brian's playbook flips both ideas on their head. Share this one with a buddy in the firehouse, the cockpit, or any W-2 grind who's been waiting for permission to start, and take a second to follow, rate, and review the show so more people find it. More high-signal conversations coming next.
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    39 mins
  • Speed to Lead Follow-Up and the 20% Most Investors Leave Behind ft. James Heartquist

    Speed to Lead Follow-Up and the 20% Most Investors Leave Behind ft. James Heartquist
    Jun 11 2026
    This week I'm joined by James Heartquist from Property Leads, a pay-per-lead company built specifically for real estate investors who want to stop chasing cold lists and start fielding inbound sellers ready to move. James has worked with hundreds of investors across the country and has a front-row seat to what separates the operators doing deals from the ones who can't convert leads they already paid for.We get into everything — what a lead actually is (and why most investors don't agree on the answer), why speed to lead is still the single most important KPI you're probably not tracking tightly enough, and the follow-up structure that gives you a real shot at the 20% of leads most investors quietly throw away. We also talk about RCS messaging, the trust recession hitting the real estate education space, and what James is bringing to the REI Tech Unlocked event in Dallas this September.Episode Timeline & Highlights[0:41] – Jordan introduces James Heartquist and the core focus: lead generation, red flags, and follow-up discipline[1:38] – James defines what Property Leads is and how it works as a pay-per-lead marketing company[2:28] – How to align with your lead provider on what "a lead" actually means before you spend a dollar[3:51] – Property Leads' definition: a seller who wants to sell within six months, on or off market[4:43] – Why investing in leads without a real follow-up system is just burning money[5:28] – Speed to lead: why 10 minutes is already too slow and how to build toward a 30–60 second response[6:59] – Door knocking, FaceTime calls, and the small extra moves that separate closers from browsers[10:28] – Why static follow-up cadences are dead and what smart agents do differently[11:11] – The stat that should wake up every investor: 20% of refunded no-response leads sell to someone within 12 months[13:18] – The 15–20 touch point framework for the first five days, and why a simple message beats no message every time[17:17] – Red flags to watch for in any paid lead provider — and how Property Leads built live transfers to fix friction in the sales process[18:53] – The "home seller experience" upgrade: why treating the seller like a client cuts required touchpoints dramatically[24:28] – RCS messaging explained: what it is, why it matters, and how embedded video will change the first impression game[27:37] – The trust recession in real estate — and why the guru fatigue problem is partly self-inflicted[30:36] – How to evaluate a coaching community the right way: are people actually making money?[33:11] – Preview of REI Tech Unlocked, September 19–21 in Dallas: what James and Property Leads are bringing to the event5 Key TakeawaysSpeed to Lead Is Your Most Important KPI — The investors winning on paid leads are calling within 30 to 60 seconds, not 10 minutes. If your CRM isn't tracking this number, that's the first thing to fix — not your scripts.Most Investors Quit Too Early on Follow-Up — Property Leads data shows 20% of leads refunded for "no response" end up selling to someone within 12 months. The person with the longest follow-up runway is usually the one who closes it.Align on the Definition of a Lead Before You Buy — What you consider a lead and what your provider considers a lead can be completely different things. Getting on the same page before you spend money is the conversation most investors skip.Your Lead Provider Is a Growth Partner, Not a Vendor — The best outcomes come from treating the relationship as a two-way feedback loop. Extreme ownership over your conversion numbers, paired with honest communication with your provider, is what actually moves the needle.RCS Is Coming and It Will Change First Contact — Rich Communication Services will allow investors to embed video directly into text messages — no links, no friction. The operators who move early on trust-building tech will have a real edge as seller skepticism continues to rise.Links & ResourcesProperty Leads — propertyleads.com (listener credit available — link to be dropped in show notes)SmrtPhone — the only phone system built for real estate investors; 5,000 minutes free calling at signupREI Tech Unlocked — September 19–21, Dallas, TX; implementation-focused event with Property Leads and other tech partners in attendanceThat Real Estate Tech Guy — thatrealestateguy.comThanks for tuning in to this week's episode. If you're spending money on leads and not tracking speed to lead or running a real follow-up sequence, this conversation with James is the push you needed. Share it with a fellow investor who needs to hear it. More high-signal conversations coming next.
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    38 mins
  • Why Most Real Estate Investors Hit a Capital Ceiling and How to Break Through It ft. Ari Page

    Why Most Real Estate Investors Hit a Capital Ceiling and How to Break Through It ft. Ari Page
    Jun 4 2026
    This week I'm joined by Ari Paige, founder of Fund and Grow, a 19-year-old business credit consulting company that has helped over 35,000 businesses access more than $2.1 billion in funding through 0% introductory business credit cards. Ari originally got into this space as a real estate investor himself, which gives him a grounded, practical perspective on exactly where capital gaps show up.The conversation covers how real estate investors can use business credit cards as gap financing, bridge capital, and rehab funding within BRRRR and fix-and-flip strategies, and why compliance in this space matters far more than most people realize. If you've ever hit a ceiling in your investing because funds were tied up in the last deal, this episode is for you.Episode Timeline & Highlights[0:51] – Jordan introduces Ari Paige and Fund and Grow, previewing the topic of business credit for real estate capital[4:00] – Ari explains the origin of Fund and Grow and why real estate investors are the core audience for 0% business credit cards[5:17] – Jordan breaks down three investor types and asks which level benefits most from Fund and Grow's model[6:37] – Ari explains bridge capital, reducing hard money costs, and why 80% of Fund and Grow clients are real estate investors[7:44] – The key difference between traditional loans and business credit cards: you only pay when you use the balance[8:52] – Real cost comparison: hard money at 3–5 points up front vs. 0% business credit with no payment until the balance is placed[9:16] – JPMorgan's $80 billion small business lending commitment and why business credit cards are the primary vehicle banks are using[11:13] – How compliant payment services like Plastiq and Melius let investors pay vendors and fund escrow accounts using credit cards[12:10] – What makes a credit stacking company non-compliant: bait-and-switch marketing, cash liquidation schemes, and hidden fees[18:15] – Fund and Grow's credentials: Inc. 5000 for seven years, A+ BBB, and a new industry association being formed to self-police credit stacking compliance[28:52] – Ari walks through the BRRRR infinite money loop using business credit for down payments, rehab costs, and gap financing[37:09] – Fund and Grow generated $175 million in funding in 2025, with 72.4% coming from post-approval negotiation coaching[41:37] – Why AI cannot replace Fund and Grow's consulting: sequencing strategy, real-time approval data, and 35,000 client history[44:15] – How to get started with Fund and Grow's free pre-qualification tool at fundandgrow.com5 Key TakeawaysBusiness Credit Cards Are Not Loans — Unlike hard money or bank loans, 0% business credit cards don't start costing you anything until you use them. That means you can hold $200,000 in available credit and pay zero interest between deals, making them a fundamentally different capital tool.Compliance Is Not Optional in This Space — Many credit stacking companies are violating FTC rules right now, including misrepresenting products as "funding" instead of credit cards, promising cash liquidation, and applying for personal cards that hurt consumer credit scores. Working with the wrong company can damage your credit, expose your affiliates, and draw FTC scrutiny.The Infinite Money Loop Works Across Strategies — Whether you're wholesaling, doing fix-and-flips, or running BRRRR deals, business credit cards can cover gap financing, down payments, and rehab costs. The 12 to 18 month 0% window is long enough to complete most exits before interest ever kicks in.Most Funding Gains Come From Negotiation, Not Applications — Fund and Grow's 2025 data shows that 72.4% of the $175 million they generated came after the initial application, through client coaching on limit increases, card consolidation, and underwriter reconsideration calls. Application help alone is not where the value lives.AI Cannot Replace Human Credit Strategy — AI can't tell you how a lender is evaluating your profile right now, build a sequencing strategy based on last month's approvals and declines, or apply the judgment built from 35,000 clients. People using ChatGPT for credit applications are racking up hard inquiries and getting no approvals.Links & ResourcesFund and Grow — fundandgrow.comFund and Grow Pre-Qualification Tool — fundandgrow.com (free, soft inquiry, no obligation)SmrtPhone — the only phone system built for real estate investorsPlastiq — plastiq.com (compliant business card payment service)Melius Payments — compliant business card payment serviceBill.com — compliant business card payment serviceIf the idea of using 0% business credit to fund deposits, rehab costs, and gap financing clicked for you during this episode, send it to a wholesaler or flipper in your network who's been stuck waiting on capital between deals. Ari and his team are the real deal, 19 years and 35,000 clients deep. Head to fundandgrow.com to run through the free ...
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    47 mins
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