In this episode of Make It Mindful, Seth talks with Jessica Werner, Ph.D., founder and CEO of Northshore Learning, about why teacher burnout is better understood as a systems problem than a personal one — and what happens when schools try to fix it without addressing the foundations that are already shaky. Jessica draws on her doctoral research in Uganda, where a policy expanding secondary school access flooded classrooms without providing additional support, and connects that experience directly to what she's seeing now in U.S. schools facing school choice expansion, teacher shortages, and the pressure to adopt every new initiative at once.

Together, Seth and Jessica explore why measuring teacher wellbeing is so difficult and why qualitative judgment still matters, how cultural context shapes what counts as a behavior problem and what motivates students, what schedules and workloads quietly signal to teachers about how much their effectiveness actually matters, and why adding initiatives on top of weak foundations accelerates burnout rather than solving it. Jessica also shares a specific example from a school in Colombia where an American teacher adapted her math instruction to work with — rather than against — the social, collective culture of her students, offering a concrete picture of what culturally responsive intervention looks like in practice.

Key topics:

• Teacher efficacy as a component of job satisfaction and retention
• The limits of quantitative measurement for wellbeing
• Cultural differences in student motivation: intrinsic vs. extrinsic
• Schedule design and its unintended impact on teachers
• Addition without subtraction: the workload problem
• School choice policy and the costs of rapid enrollment growth
• Neuroscience basics that translate directly into classroom management
• School-student "match" as a framework for the future of school choice

Links & Resources:

• Northshore Learning — coaching, school partnerships, and on-demand courses for educators: northshorelearning.org
• Jessica Werner on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jessica-werner-ph-d-818032163
• Northshore Learning YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCznAU47jszmmJyFBWd_1Lvw
• Hidden Brain podcast with Shankar Vedantam (recommended by Jessica): hiddenbrain.org
• Justin Reich, MIT Teaching Systems Lab — referenced by Seth on "addition by subtraction" in schools: https://makeitmindful.transistor.fm/episodes/76-experiment-with-humility-teaching-in-the-ai-evidence-gap-with-justin-reich

Guest Bio: Jessica Werner, Ph.D.

Jessica Werner is the founder and CEO of Northshore Learning, where she works with schools in the U.S. and internationally to support teacher effectiveness and student behavior through personalized coaching, group training, and on-demand professional development. Her work is grounded in neuroscience and centers on what actually allows teachers to feel effective — and what systematically undermines that feeling over time. Jessica holds a Ph.D. in education, with doctoral research focused on the implementation challenges of Uganda's universal secondary education policy, and has over 20 years of experience as a classroom teacher, professor of education, and consultant.

About the Host: Seth Fleischauer is the founder of Banyan Global Learning and host of Make It Mindful: Insights for Global Learning. Through Banyan, he designs live virtual programs that connect K-12 classrooms to global peers and expert facilitators. See banyangloballearning.com.

In this episode of Make It Mindful, Seth Fleischauer talks with international school consultant Chris O'Shaughnessy about narrative therapy — what it is, why it matters, and how its techniques can quietly transform the way educators approach empathy, resilience, and cross-cultural understanding. What begins as a conversation about storytelling opens into something much bigger: a practical framework for helping students separate fact from interpretation, build emotional muscle in measurable steps, and find common ground even when values genuinely clash.

Along the way, Chris draws on everything from gym metaphors to the Enneagram to a sociology study involving voluntary self-electrocution to make the case that the oldest human art form — telling stories — might also be one of the most powerful tools in a teacher's toolkit.

Together, Seth and Chris explore the neuroscience of narrative, the taxonomy of resilience, and what it looks like to introduce intentional discomfort into a classroom — including the surprisingly radical act of letting kids be bored.

Key Topics Discussed:

• What narrative therapy actually is — and why it's less about therapy and more about learning to hold your own story at arm's length
• The description → evaluation → interpretation framework, and how a photograph of a woman in a wedding dress teaches you more about assumptions than any lecture could
• Why our brains prefer a complete story to an accurate one — and what that costs us
• The "gym as intentional inefficiency" model: how to introduce beneficial discomfort in measurable, safe steps
• Dr. Wong's taxonomy of resilience — cognitive, behavioral, emotional, relational, and motivational — and why giving students language for these differences is itself an act of empowerment
• What to do when cross-cultural conflict isn't a misunderstanding — it's a genuine clash of values
• The Enneagram as a tool for digging beneath belief systems to find the shared motivations underneath
• Why boredom might be the most underrated creative catalyst in schools — and the sociology study that proves people would rather electrocute themselves than sit with it
• Awe as an emerging opportunity in education (Seth's answer to Chris's lightning round question)

Guest Bio:

Chris O'Shaughnessy is an international school consultant whose work takes him into schools across cultures and contexts around the world. Drawing on a background in sociology, he helps educators build the skills — empathy, resilience, cross-cultural communication — that don't show up on a standardized test but determine everything about how students navigate the world. He is based at chris-o.com.

Host Bio:

Seth Fleischauer is the founder of Banyan Global Learning and host of the Make It Mindful podcast. His work focuses on global learning, cultural competency, and the evolving role of technology in education. Through Banyan Global Learning, he develops live virtual learning experiences that connect students to new people, places, and ways of thinking.

Episode Links:

• Chris O'Shaughnessy's website: chris-o.com
• Unselfie: Why Empathetic Kids Succeed in Our All-About-Me World — Michele Borba
• Sticks and Stones: Defeating the Culture of Bullying and Rediscovering the Power of Character and Empathy — Emily Bazelon
• Project Hail Mary — Andy Weir
• The Homework Machine podcast — Justin Reich, MIT Teaching Systems Lab

In this episode of Make It Mindful, Seth Fleischauer talks with child development expert and author Deborah Farmer Kris about awe — what it is, why it matters, and why it might be the missing piece at the center of meaningful education. What begins as a conversation about a single emotion opens up into something much bigger: a research-backed framework for understanding how wonder drives curiosity, curiosity drives intrinsic motivation, and motivation unlocks the kind of deep learning that tests can't easily measure. Along the way, Seth reflects on how awe has been quietly powering his own work at Banyan Global Learning all along — he just didn't have a word for it until now.

Together, Seth and Deborah explore the neuroscience of wonder, the contagious nature of teacher enthusiasm, and what it means to make your classroom an oasis of awe — even inside a system that doesn't always make space for it.

Key Topics Discussed:

• What awe actually is — and how researchers know when someone is feeling it (hint: it's not just the Grand Canyon)
• The difference between awe and curiosity, and why they're more intertwined than most educators realize
• The research-backed chain from awe → curiosity → intrinsic motivation → deeper learning
• How awe primes the brain for memory — and why starting with wonder, not ending with it, changes everything
• Collective effervescence and neurosynchronicity: why learning together in a state of shared wonder produces measurably better outcomes
• Why teacher awe is contagious — and what that means for how we think about subject mastery and classroom culture
• The "small self" effect: how awe quiets cognitive chatter, restores perspective, and makes us more likely to help a stranger
• Why human kindness and bravery — not nature — turn out to be the most common source of awe across cultures
• The tension between awe and the structures of schooling: mystery vs. certainty, slow attention vs. coverage, wonder vs. testing
• Why Montessori education may be quietly ahead of the curve as AI reshapes what schools need to do
• A real conversation about teenagers, art museums, and whether you can — or should — engineer awe for your kids

Guest Bio:

Deborah Farmer Kris is a child development expert, educator, and author whose work explores the intersection of social-emotional learning, positive psychology, and how children grow. She writes regularly for PBS Kids and NPR's MindShift, and her Substack, Raising Awe-Seekers, brings the latest research on wonder and well-being directly to parents and educators. Her book on the science of awe and childhood is available now.

Host Bio:

Seth Fleischauer is the founder of Banyan Global Learning and host of the Make It Mindful podcast. His work focuses on global learning, cultural competency, and the evolving role of technology in education. Through Banyan Global Learning, he develops live virtual learning experiences that connect students to people, places, and ideas around the world.

Episode Links:

• Deborah Farmer Kris's website and resources: parenthood365.com
• Raising Awe-Seekers Substack: raisingaweseekers.substack.com
• Dacher Keltner's awe research at UC Berkeley: https://greatergood.berkeley.edu
• Ethan Cross, Author of Chatter and Shift: https://www.ethankross.com/
• Mary Oliver, "The Summer Day"
• The Good Whale podcast (New York Times)
• The Overstory by Richard Powers