Sarah Marshall spent over two decades attending Burning Man — starting in 2001 when she arrived tightly wound, ready to bolt, and wholly unprepared for a place that asked for the full, unguarded version of herself. A military veteran turned engineer who had recently transitioned, she wasn’t ready to be seen. What she found, eventually, was a gift economy that knocks down social walls, a participation culture that makes observers feel lonelier than anyone, and a community that became a second family. Twenty-plus years later, she’s written Playa Dust in My Soul — a novel following seven characters through a single week on the playa, each broken in their own way, each searching for where they belong.

This conversation covers what Burning Man is beneath the spectacle, how radical generosity creates radical vulnerability, what happens when you confuse identity with a story you’ve invented, and why that alkali dust embeds somewhere inside you that you can never quite wash out.

Shownotes with Chapters:

00:17 — Who Is Sarah Marshall?: Military veteran, engineer, and novelist. Sarah has attended Burning Man for over 20 years. Her debut novel, Playa Dust in My Soul, is a love letter to the experience.

01:24 — What Burning Man Actually Is: Not the spectacle. The Black Rock Desert, the 80,000-person temporary city, and what it means to build something on a blank alkali canvas — then leave it pristine.

05:21 — Why She Went the First Time: Two groups of friends said she needed to go. A year or two into her transition, she drove out alone with an escape hatch — and spent the first few days wishing she’d used it.

07:39 — The Gift Economy and Participation: Why being offered things for free knocks down walls in ways nothing else does — and why watching instead of participating leaves you the loneliest person in a crowd of thousands.

13:38 — Wanting to Be Wallpaper in a Place With No Walls: Buttoned down in a place calling for full self-expression. Being trans was suddenly front and center — not because people cared, but because she’d been carrying it as a barrier.

14:43 — Twelve Cantaloupes and the Shift: She wasn’t participating. So she diced up the cantaloupes she’d inexplicably packed and wandered camp to camp giving fruit to strangers. A simple act that unlocked something.

21:06 — Two Kinds of People at Burning Man: Those who arrive and transform, and those who feel born for it. Sarah was the first. Her daughter, who first went at age five, was firmly the second.

25:47 — Belonging and the Lost Art of Depending on Each Other: What Burning Man recreates that modern life has quietly eliminated. No signal, no escape from the immediate. People have to actually show up for each other.

30:49 — 6,000 Fluffies and the Most Miserable People: Her favorite ritual: stuffing a backpack with garments at night and riding out to find whoever needed one most. The gift economy as radical noticing.

32:17 — The Story She’d Been Telling Herself: She’d decided her campmates saw her as a novelty — entirely her own invention. The moment she dropped it, they were there with open arms.

33:58 — Writing the Book — Over 20 Years: Conceived in the mid-2000s; two decades finding the story inside the information. Like a sculptor removing everything that isn’t the horse.

34:46 — Seven Characters, Seven Lenses: A DPW worker, newbies, a sculptor, veterans — each with a different relationship to belonging, each giving readers a distinct angle into the playa.

41:21 — Year One to Year Twenty: From barely functional individual to village mayor to the person who wrote the guide the whole village now runs on. The arc of contribution.

47:39 — The Slow Transformation: Most people need months after Burning Man to understand what happened. The transformation doesn’t end when you drive out. The dust is already inside you.

49:22 — What Playa Dust in My Soul Means: The alkali dust is unavoidable and irreversible. The title is about being permanently marked — coming back unable to be entirely the same.

Resources Mentioned:

Playa Dust in My Soul by Sarah Marshall — Her debut novel — a fictional love letter to Burning Man. https://www.playadustinmysoul.com/

Burning Man — Annual event in the Black Rock Desert, Nevada. https://burningman.org/

Drewbie Wilson did everything right. He climbed from $40,000 a year in insurance to half a million, landed private jet trips, built a commercial gym in the garage, and bought the second fridge — the garage fridge, which he’ll tell you is the true sign you’ve made it.

Then in 2023, he walked away from all of it. The corporate politics had gotten unbearable, the golden handcuffs had gotten tight, and a growing sense that freedom mattered more than income finally won out. He sold the house, moved his family into a 45-foot toy hauler, and started over on his own terms. Drew is the author of seven books, host of the Call the Damn Leads podcast, and a coach who helps sales pros stop making excuses and build lives they actually want. This conversation covers discipline over motivation, the Four Sixes framework for reclaiming your time, what golden handcuffs really cost, and why the garage fridge was never the point.

Shownotes with Chapters:

00:00 — Cold Open: Drewbie on selling the house, the pool, and the garage fridge — and realizing you don’t need as much as you think.

00:49 — Who Is Drewbie Wilson?: Half a million a year, big Texas house, private jet trips — then he walked away. A sales coach and author who rebuilt his life in a 42-foot camper.

01:55 — Everyone Is in Sales: Selling isn’t a profession — it’s a life skill. Convincing your kids to brush their teeth or your friends to play hooky: it’s all sales, and it’s all service.

04:37 — The Follow-Up as an Act of Service: The challenge: go into your phone and find five people you haven’t talked to in a while. Reach out. You never know when that message lands at exactly the right moment.

06:31 — Discipline Beats Motivation: Drewbie traces this back to 2016 — 80 pounds up, a new baby, and 5 a.m. walks. Motivation gets you started. Discipline keeps you going when it’s cold and raining.

10:52 — Change the People Around You: The friends who called personal development ‘woo woo nonsense’ weren’t bad people — they just weren’t going where he was going. The real cost of growth is relational.

15:06 — The Client Who Couldn’t Value His Own Time: The guy who wanted to escape his W-2 job but couldn’t say what his time was worth. Drewbie’s version of Death showing up with a scythe — and a $20 bill.

20:30 — The Four Sixes: 24 hours, four areas: rest, self, business, relationships. Six hours each. Most people don’t know how badly out of balance they are until they track it, hour by hour, for seven days.

26:10 — Lessons from the Boiler Room: Stories from the book: the podcast producer who cried in the elevator after his first $500 check, and the merchant services guy who exited through a shattered storefront window.

31:45 — The Joyful Rebellion Moment: You check all the boxes, do everything right, and still feel something’s off. That’s when the real work begins.

34:08 — Systems Over Willpower: Drewbie’s color-coded Google Calendar Tetris board, Atomic Habits, and the microwave meal metaphor. Follow the instructions on the box.

41:31 — Young and Hungry vs. Stuck at the Plateau: The difference between a two-year sales pro and a twenty-year veteran isn’t skill — it’s fire. When you’ve proven everyone wrong, you need a new reason to keep going.

49:56 — How Drewbie Became a Coach: From drug-dealing degenerate to $10,000 in a weekend running Facebook ads. The moment Nancy offered him $75 for an hour on the phone and he almost said $50.

1:01:12 — Why He Sold Everything and Bought the Camper: The corporate politics, the Vegas babysitter bills, the camping memories — and the call about his father-in-law’s cancer that made the freedom worth every sacrifice.

1:07:24 — Final Word: True freedom isn’t money — it’s being able to show up where you’re needed, when you’re needed, as the person you actually want to be.

Resources Mentioned:

Call the Damn Leads: Books, coaching, training, and all things Drewbie: https://callthedamnleads.com/

Lessons from the Boiler Room by Drewbie Wilson — His latest book — stories from guests on his podcast about grit, failure, and unconventional success.: https://callthedamnleads.com/collections/books/products/lessons-from-the-boiler-room-volume-1

Call the Damn Leads (podcast) — Drewbie’s show for sales professionals and entrepreneurs: https://callthedamnleads.com/blogs/podcastepisodes

Most of us are really good at looking like we've got it together. Becca Eve Young decided to stop pretending.

She's a coach, author, and former corporate climber who did all the things — MBA, corner office, company going public — and watched it all collapse in the same year her dad died, stranded alone in rural Mexico during a global pandemic. What came out the other side was a book called It's Gonna Get Messy.

She helps people stop performing their lives and start actually living them.

We talk about the societal scripts we never agreed to, the inner knowing we keep ignoring, what it really costs to keep the mess hidden, and why the connections we're all looking for are on the other side of being honest about the hard stuff.

If you've ever had the nagging feeling that the life you've built doesn't quite fit, this one's going to hit.

Shownotes with Chapters:

00:00 Embracing Your Inner Knowing

00:56 Introduction: Losing It All and Finding the Mess

01:39 Why the Mess Is Where Connection Lives

04:34 Breaking Through Growing Up with Shame

05:53 Moving Past the Societal Script

08:24 A Desert Timeout in Rural Mexico

11:20 Unlearning the Rules and Questioning Everything

14:49 A Transcendental Connection with Dad

17:01 Landing Back on Earth and Resetting Reality

18:49 Reprogramming the Mindset with Daily Practices

22:17 Having Compassion for the Mistakes We Make

26:12 Writing the Book for a Past Version of Yourself

29:55 Common Threads: The Cost of Ignoring Intuition

35:42 Moving Through Fear and Asking for Help

39:17 Recognizing the Patterns to Evolve Faster

45:33 Doing the "Mess Reps" and Micro-Moments of Trust

50:32 Connecting with Becca and Stepping into Purpose

52:40 Final Thoughts: Embracing Structure and the Fundamentals

Resources Mentioned:

Website: https://www.beccaeveyoung.com/

Book Title: It's Gonna Get Messy (Available on Amazon in paperback, Kindle, and Audible formats)